Pirelli Tyres.....**F1 set to abandon switch to 16-inch tyres for 2026**

[erwin greven]

Bottom post of the previous page:

[Everso Biggyballies]

I wonder if there was any competition from other manufacturers. All I heard were rumours and maybes as to a fight for the right to say we won every GP last year.....

[PTRACER]

I wonder if there was any competition from other manufacturers. All I heard were rumours and maybes as to a fight for the right to say we won every GP last year.....

You can imagine them making sure the contract said they were exclusive, else they wouldn't sign.

I reckon it's one reason why there's also so much about Andretti joining F1 as a team is because it reduces the exclusivity of the other 10 (and I guess the overall share of the money).

[Aty]

Competition for a contract? Sure. It's healthy economic tool.

Two tire suppliers? Thanks, but no thanks. I have very little desire to hear from whining Norris (factual or not) how he could win in Qatar had he have the same tire Max had.

Two tire suppliers interject another factor beyond driver's control. I rather see a driver vs. driver road rage in similar (yet not the same) equipment.

[PTRACER]

Competition for a contract? Sure. It's healthy economic tool.

Two tire suppliers? Thanks, but no thanks. I have very little desire to hear from whining Norris (factual or not) how he could win in Qatar had he have the same tire Max had.

Two tire suppliers interject another factor beyond driver's control. I rather see a driver vs. driver road rage in similar (yet not the same) equipment.

The Racing Driver's Book of Excuses is a very thick book.

[Aty]

Competition for a contract? Sure. It's healthy economic tool.

Two tire suppliers? Thanks, but no thanks. I have very little desire to hear from whining Norris (factual or not) how he could win in Qatar had he have the same tire Max had.

Two tire suppliers interject another factor beyond driver's control. I rather see a driver vs. driver road rage in similar (yet not the same) equipment.

The Racing Driver's Book of Excuses is a very thick book.

I have to agree with the book analogy, but I lived through era when one famous Japanese tire company was at competition with a famous French company. It were ugly times, and I am lacking ambition and desire to see something like that again any time soon.

[Michael Ferner]

I have to agree with Aty here, tyre wars are an iffy thing, they are expensive and fraught with irregular and arbitrary race results. The last one I experienced in full was the Bridgestone/Goodyear battles in 1997/'98, which brought us an Arrows (!) leading a Grand Prix on merit, and a zig-zag of McLaren/Ferrari dominance the next year. Entertaining in some ways, but often frustrating for the competitors who sometimes didn't know from where the wind was blowing, or how and why it shifted so suddenly.

Then again, irregular and arbitrary race results, that's what F1's about these days, isn't it? The different compounds, isn't that an attempt at simulating a tyre war, without the actual expenses it usually brings? Another gimmick in a gimmick ridden sport...

[MonteCristo]

Entertaining in some ways, but often frustrating for the competitors who sometimes didn't know from where the wind was blowing, or how and why it shifted so suddenly.

I humbly disagree. As you said, they were there on merit.

Not because someone got a grid penalty, or an in-race penalty (the variety of which depends on the race director's mood at the time). Or because someone got screwed by a red flag in qualifying to miss progressing. Not because a VSC, SC came out mid-race. Or because a red flag came out and gave someone a free change of tyres or allowed them to fix damage that they would have otherwise retired from (or fallen laps behind fixing).

It's no different to a car that's lightning fast on a straight being great at Monza. Or a pretty rubbish car overall being rather decent in Monaco's tight turns.

I don't pine for tyre wars as a fix to modern F1, but if a second or third manufacturer joined, I wouldn't say no.

[Michael Ferner]

I don't think we disagree. A tyre war is in no way comparable to the stuff you mention, that's right, but I wasn't insinuating that. The 'gimmick' I mentioned is, for me, the different tyre compounds by a single supplier to simulate a tyre war without the costs (and let's not forget, a large portion of those costs is testing, which is limited anyway these days; that would have to change and that's why it's not going to happen anyway).

[Everso Biggyballies]

I wonder if there was any competition from other manufacturers. All I heard were rumours and maybes as to a fight for the right to say we won every GP last year.....

It seems. there was quite stiff competition for. the tender, from a keen to return Bridgestone.

Bridgestone I believe based their pitch on the sustainable angle, one of the specific provisos on the original FIA tender documents.

In their words Bridgestone’s bid to win the tyre tender included proposals to introduce “advanced innovative technology”. It has been accepted that the BS tender put forward very strong cases that they were the one to pick. But, they didnt and the world moves on.

Although the Bridgestone tender was not well publicised during the process it seems BS are now focussing on their realisation of motorsports as a good proving ground for judging progress, and that does include a future planned return to F1..

It believes that some advanced technologies that Bridgestone has been developing for its road car products would be perfect for F1 application.

The nuts and bolts of the BS potential would have been in taking its innovative Enliten road tyre technology and applying it to F1..... the tyre construction process, uses extensive recycled materials, and has helped produce road tyres that are around 20% lighter than their previous equivalent.

This helps reduce rolling resistance, delivering improved fuel mileage and can help with car handling too as the wheel’s mass is less. It is also far more sustainable, as 63% of its components are recycled and the products are lighter to ship.

All the sort of words the FIA and I guess the eco conscious folk that have to be (rightfully) kept happy from a sustainable angle seems to be the backbone of Bridgestones attempted future F1 return.

It is thought Pirelli will bail after 2028 when its marketing and technological objectives will they say have been met. (The current deal in until 2027 with a years extension an option)

Bridgestone seem to be hot to trot for a 2029 F1 return.

Some Bridgestone words and thoughts:

It said: “As Bridgestone celebrates the 60th anniversary of its motorsport activities in 2023, the company continues to support sustainable global premium motorsport.

“F1 is the world’s most prestigious global motorsport platform and Bridgestone has been studying F1 as one of the various options to support its sustainable global premium motorsports strategy.

“Bridgestone has sincerely and continuously been communicating with FIA and FOG [Formula One Group] regarding the next tyre tender period for F1 and proposed advanced innovative technology and sustainability initiatives.”

Shuichi Ishibashi, Member of the Board, Global CEO and Representative Executive Officer, Bridgestone Corporation, said that while the company had not been successful with its bid now, the feedback it had got from F1 and the FIA had encouraged it in developing its technology.

“While Bridgestone will not be able to support F1 this time, the process received positive recognition from FIA and FOG and has reinforced the value being created by Bridgestone’s advanced innovative technology, including sustainability initiatives across the value chain and the “Ultimate Customization” of its new ENLITEN® technology, which can be changed based on the needs of different racing conditions,” he said.

“Likewise, Bridgestone will continue to passionately push its technology and innovation through the mobile lab and proving ground that motorsport offers, strengthening its pursuit of sustainable global premium motorsport activities.

“Lastly, through motorsport, Bridgestone will strive to achieve its corporate commitment for "Emotion: Committed to inspiring excitement and spreading joy to the world of mobility" described in its Bridgestone E8 commitment.

“Through its ongoing efforts, Bridgestone will drive greater passion for motorsport, earn emotion and empathy, and promote co-creation for sustainable future together with many partners.”

[Michael Ferner]

Can somebody please translate this promo babble into comprehensible English?

[Everso Biggyballies]

I don't think we disagree. A tyre war is in no way comparable to the stuff you mention, that's right, but I wasn't insinuating that. The 'gimmick' I mentioned is, for me, the different tyre compounds by a single supplier to simulate a tyre war without the costs (and let's not forget, a large portion of those costs is testing, which is limited anyway these days; that would have to change and that's why it's not going to happen anyway).

F1 has not ruled out a future tyre war....

Talking of tyre wars Domenicali has today not dismissed a return to tyres being provided by more than one supplier. He actually suggest that multiple tyre suppliers will make the show better. Its always about 'the show' these days.

Seems a strange statement as back in the early noughties when we had a tyre 'competition' it was so expensive, given that most of the testing was tyre testing. It doesnt fit into the whole cost cap scenario. Unless it becomes an area where tyres are outside the cap. (When is a cost cap not a cost cap?) It was all to do with costs that we went to a single tyre supplier.

Domenicali then went into full waffle mode for several paragraphs before saying in effect they dont know. But he said it in multiple different ways.

...It is too premature to consider that this could be a possibility for the future...
...It is not yet on the agenda to see if this could be a possibility in the future,...
...if you’re able to control the different mechanisms of the costs, why not?...
...But so far, it is not on the agenda of the discussions, together with the FIA, and with the teams...

With lots of other words and padding in between. Could have just said its a "definite maybe".

[Michael Ferner]

Well, they would say that, wouldn't they? I mean, anyone not knowing that it's a control tyre could get the impression that Pirelli are not afraid of opposition, and that they are the sole suppliers because others are in awe of their qualities. What a BS show, makes me lose all sympathy for Pirelli.

[Everso Biggyballies]

F1 and Pirelli to work on all-new tyre concept for 2025

Pirelli will begin investigating a new Formula 1 tyre concept for 2025 that reduces degradation to improve the on-track racing, while still allowing for varied pitstop strategies.

Background

After Pirelli designed new 23-inch tyres for the initial switch to ground effect cars last season, subsequent aerodynamic development from teams has led to complaints about how easily the tyres now overheat from the altered airflow.

While F1 has desired multiple pitstops to create divergent strategies, and this means that the tyre must markedly degrade, drivers have increasingly spoken out against the high wear that prevents them from pushing throughout a stint.

As such, Pirelli - is to begin research into a new tyre concept.

Pirelli motorsport boss Mario Isola told select media,: "Without high degradation, there is no reason to target a two-stop race.

"But also, I believe that most of the action on track is due to tyre degradation and how you are able to manage tyre degradation.

"If you reduce that, I am convinced that the risk is to have a train of cars because obviously, if you can push, I can push, everybody can push. It is not a different tyre for each driver.

"So, I understand drivers who are complaining about high tyre degradation because they would like to push more, and this is a clear indication."

As a result of the ongoing complaints, Isola confirmed Pirelli will start a specific analysis on the issue in the "next weeks".

He continued: "What we want to understand is how we modify the action on track and reduce the degradation. This is something we can do.

Pirelli will work with F1 and the teams to conduct its investigation since its own simulator tools to predict strategies do not account for the effects of running in traffic.

Since the construction and range of tyre compounds for 2024 have already been defined and locked in, any changes would not make their grand prix debut until 2025.

Isola continued: "It is important that, for the future, we have these kinds of targets clarified in advance.

"We need to understand what is good for the sport, taking into consideration the advice, the comments from the drivers but for the benefit of the sport."

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/f1-a ... /10543651/

What could possibly go wrong.

[Michael Ferner]

They could implant explosives, which generate blowouts on a random basis. Good for the show.

[MonteCristo]

They could implant explosives, which generate blowouts on a random basis. Good for the show.

Open to fan vote, of course.

Top tier monthly subscribers get double the voting power. What a deal!