Supercars Gen 3 Discussion thread

WTCC, BTCC, DTM and Aussie V8s
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Re: Supercars Gen 3 Discussion thread

Post by Everso Biggyballies » 5 months ago

Latest post of the previous page:

Gen 3 launch live stream

If anyone wants to watch the unveiling / public launch of the new Gen 3 cars tomorrow Supercars are streaming it live. Well, its already tomorrow here and it starts at 7:30 am here, so that is about 4 hours time. :wink:

Fans will be able to watch the official launch of both the Gen3 Chevrolet Camaro ZL1 and Ford Mustang GT live from this year’s Repco Bathurst 1000.

Both the Gen3 Camaro and Mustang will be officially unveiled on Friday December 3 at Mount Panorama.

Fans will be able to watch the special ceremony streamed live on Supercars YouTube channel and Supercars Facebook page. (links below)

Fans can also watch the launch on Supercars Twitter account and Supercars team's Facebook pages.

The livestream will commence at 7:35am AEDT. (21:35 in Europe I think)
https://www.supercars.com/news/champion ... n3-launch/


This is on their youtube age as being the link. You can set a reminder for an email when it goes live.

Gen3 Launch EVENT - Repco Bathurst 1000 | Supercars 2021





or if you do Facebook here: https://www.facebook.com/supercars/live/

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Post by Everso Biggyballies » 5 months ago

Here is a replay of the Gen 3 launch for those who missed it.

It should go straight to the start and miss the countdown that started nearly 10 minutes ahead of the launch..... if not just skip that to about 9:45 in


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Post by MonteCristo » 5 months ago

Certainly didn't skimp on the fog machine.
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Post by Everso Biggyballies » 5 months ago

MonteCristo wrote:
5 months ago
Certainly didn't skimp on the fog machine.
:haha: :haha: Who has a launch without the fog machine? Got to have a way of hiding the missing / unfinished bits on prototypes

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Post by theracer120 » 5 months ago

The Mustang looks a lot better so that's good, not that it would be difficult to make it look better then the current one.

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Post by Everso Biggyballies » 5 months ago

Gen 3 cars hit the track.....

Image

ImageImage

Image

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Post by Everso Biggyballies » 5 months ago

Just copied this post out of the Bathurst thread where it came u in discussion but the context was more Gen 3.... and there is more news on the subject of Jaguar.....
theracer120 wrote:
5 months ago
Everso Biggyballies wrote:
5 months ago
MonteCristo wrote:
5 months ago
Not engaged enough to know what's going on with the manufacturers.

Is it just Chevy and Ford? Or is Nissan coming back.

They look and sound the part at least. The Mustang doesn't look like a toy anymore.
There have been threats of "talks with other manus. but it never gets further than a threat followed by a general denial from the manu of serious interest. Walkinshaw Andretti United were said to be talking to BMW.... that got as far as a few renders. But in WAU words, we are talking to others. My thought also is, do the likes of BMW and Merc want to take on GM and Ford? Not their competition in the marketlace.
The WAU/Jaguar rumours have resurfaced today (supposedly a handshake deal has been done), although it's only James Phelps (i.e. News Corp) who've said anything which doesn't exactly make me convinced it's actually happening.

@theracer120 was right to add some skepticism to the Jaguar to Gen 3 rumour..... official denial has been made

Jaguar denies any interest in Gen3 Supercars

Jaguar has refuted reports that it will partner with Walkinshaw Andretti United for a Gen3 Supercars programme. In effect their plans are already in place to be all electric by 2025 so it is far from going to happen. The "F"Type might fit into the SC concept but the V8 power currently used in the car is being phased out .

While the F-Type is a V8-powered sports car that would fit the new regulations, and the brand has an association with the Walkinshaw family from the 1980s Group A era – when Ryan’s father Tom won Bathurst in a XJS in 1985 – Jaguar has denied any interest in entering the sport.

A spokesman for Jaguar Land Rover Australia (JLR) said he had no knowledge of any discussions between WAU or Supercars. He made it clear there will be no factory support for any entry with WAU or any other team that wants to run an F-Type.

“JLR has no intention of entering Supercars racing,” the spokesman said.

While the F-Type remains one of the last V8-powered sports cars available to buy today, the brand is shifting to an electric future. By 2025, only two years after the planned introduction of Gen3, all new Jaguar models will be electric.

So as far as Jaguar signing up goes, nice story but dont let the truth get in the way of a nice story seems to be the case. :wink:

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Post by Everso Biggyballies » 5 months ago

Supercars close to ditching paddle shift, auto blip for Gen3


I have mentioned the biggest question at the moment is paddle v stick shift. It seemed despite fans and drivers wanting to retain the stick shift and with it the extra driver involvement it was all headed towards a paddle shift with auto (throttle) blip.

It seems not so fast, and stick shift is now favourite..... but not for the right reasons sadly.

Now, it has become apparent that the introduction of an electronic actuator might not happen; and instead, the manually operated gear shift could remain.

It’s understood the technical complexity of the new mechanism, the electronic actuator, is at the heart of the proposal to ditch it entirely.

Without getting too technical, the issue is related to the Xtrac transaxle,which has been the spec transmission for a few years now and is a carryover for Gen 3.

While the Xtrac set-up is flexible in that it can be operated manually or electronically, it is believed the Gen3 prototypes have suffered from technical gremlins that may prove too difficult and/or costly to overcome.

Under the new set-up seen in the Gen3 prototypes, gear changes are made by triggering a paddle shifter or lever which sends a signal to the electronic actuator to move up or down a gear.

Apparently both the Chevrolet Camaro and Ford Mustang suffered issues during a shakedown and testing at Queensland Raceway.
So on the basis of a fix / adaptation being too complicated and expensive to implement and be reliable we might just have to stay with the stickshift.

They did say at Bathurst when they launched Gen 3 to the public that the shifter decision would need to be made in the next few weeks to kee the project on track. That seems to be favouring the stay as we are easy way out.

Not yet confirmed but seemingly it wont be long.

As a purist it makes me happy. :wink:



The Ford Mustang we have seen wont be what we get next year.

Oh the other news re Gen 3 is that the bodyshell we saw for the Mustang might not be what is on the car when they launch in 2023.
Ford are known to be launching a new model and shape Mustang mid 2022 in the US, and which will filter down here by year end. It seems Ford clearly want the V8SC Series to have what is relevant to the market as the car to be raced so I believe behind the scenes that is what will happen and is no doubt in the planning area now.

Ford will no doubt cover all the homologation costs of the new body shape. I just hope it fits nicely into the Gen3 cage and Chassis so we dont end up with a race. car that looks as wrong as the current V8SC Mustang does when compared to a road car. There was an excuse for that, A two door coupe bodyshell had to be stretched to fit the 4 door Falcon / Commodore body that the Gen 2 chassis and cage was built for.

Im sure the Gen 3 version will be fine and this is more just a heads up not to expect the Gen 3 Mustang to look like what we have seen to date on the prototypes.

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Post by Everso Biggyballies » 5 months ago

Everso Biggyballies wrote:
5 months ago


The Ford Mustang we have seen wont be what we get next year.

Oh the other news re Gen 3 is that the bodyshell we saw for the Mustang might not be what is on the car when they launch in 2023.
Ford are known to be launching a new model and shape Mustang mid 2022 in the US, and which will filter down here by year end. It seems Ford clearly want the V8SC Series to have what is relevant to the market as the car to be raced so I believe behind the scenes that is what will happen and is no doubt in the planning area now.
I dug around the web looking for any images of this new S650 Ford Mustang that we are supposedly getting..... not a great deal of luck, not any "real" images anyway. Aside from spy shots, there isn’t much info available on how the S650 is going to look. The shots I did get, the cammo look ones that get snapped by eagle eye photographers themselves are from early stages where Ford is likely testing systems completely unrelated to the looks of the S650.

Image

As mentioned these cammo cars are more for testing systems and the cars when closer to production never really look like the early shots. These look more like the existing car than anything you could class as new.

However found some renders and I have to say it looks pretty good from what I saw. Have to say it seems to look a bit like the Camaro with its more rounded rear end. Hopefully the renders are more accurate than the cammo shot which seems to be a lot more square back.

What d'ya reckon....

Image

Of course not all the renders look the same either....

Image


What the V8SC version looks like will no doubt be different again, but as teaser stuff thought these images were worth posting.

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Post by Everso Biggyballies » 4 months ago

Gen3 Supercars testing to resume on Monday

Good to see that somethings are happening in Motor Racing here despite the ravages of the dreaded Coronavirus.

Testing of Supercars’ updated Gen3 prototypes will commence on Monday as part of four planned track days in quick succession.

The new Ford Mustang and Chevrolet Camaro will be running at Queensland Raceway on Monday and Tuesday next week (January 17 and 18).

Another two tests will take place at the same venue on January 24 and 25. It is planned beyond that to test at Winton Eaastern Creek and then aat Phillip Island in April to ensure the cars get to test at a variety of circuits.

Each day, there’ll be two drivers allocated to each car.

Drivers of homologation teams Triple Eight Race Engineering and Dick Johnson Racing will take the lead in week one; Shane van Gisbergen and Broc Feeney running in the Camaro, and Will Davison joined by Zane Goddard in the Mustang.

Goddard, who is set to be sidelined for the 2022 Repco Supercars Championship, was drafted in given that Anton De Pasquale is away competing in the Dubai 24 Hour.

For week two, Erebus Motorsport duo Will Brown and Brodie Kostecki will jump in the Chevrolet, while James Courtney and Tim Slade will be steering the Ford.

The only things that have been changed on the cars from when they did demo laps at Bathurst is thaat roll bars have been added front and rear.

Still no word on whether the gearchange will be stick or paddle......

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Post by Everso Biggyballies » 4 months ago

I mentioned in the previous post that testing was set to resume in anger, well start more than resume.... the onlly track time to date being a few low key PR type demo laps at Bathurst.

The testing went ahead today at QIR and from a spectator pov it seems like we might be in for a treat, Will Davison, one of the drivers involved said...........

Davison: Gen3 prototype harder and more punishing


Hard, fast, punishing and loose. That’s the assessment from Will Davison after his first day driving the Gen3 Ford Mustang in anger. :smiley:

for his first assessment of the Mustang, Davison replied,
“Harder to drive, more punishing.

“You’ve got to be quite particular the way you drive the car. The grip level is very low and the power comes on very aggressively.

“It’s exciting, you can’t be lazy, you get punished if you’re too aggressive with the car. It’ll implement more mistakes, but I’m all for that.

“I’m all for bigger braking zones, I’m all for more power again. I reckon we should have another 100 horsepower, where you can’t look after your rear tyres to save yourself. That’s me, I love it.

“The engine does have some cool characteristics and there’s just some refinement required and then it will be mechanically very critical to get a balance in the car.

“That’s what’s going to be the biggest trick for the teams to get their head around.”

As expected, the Gen3 prototypes cut lap times slower than their Gen2 predecessors.

Davison said he noticed the reduction in downforce. That was especially evident through the high-speed right-hand first turn.

“It’s a significant shift in downforce, absolutely,” Davison explained.

“You feel you’re having to manhandle the car a lot more. You’re on eggshells quite a lot.

“Just the overall grip is generally down. You definitely feel the car sits on top of the road a lot more, moves around a lot more.

“It’s quite fun. There’s a lot of corrections in the car. You’ve got to be very particular about the way you drive it. It’s a beast. It is. It does put a smile on your face.

“It’s not what we’re used to. It’s all foreign and wild. It’s very raw. I’m sure we can evolve it a bit, but we’ve got the basic concept.

“I think it will be fun,” he added.

“It’s a very hot day out here today and for sure, you get a lot of muscle memory in these cars, and all of a sudden it doesn’t do what you’re used to.

“When I say a handful, I don’t think a handful is a bad thing, to be honest. We will be able to get the balance a lot nicer.

“But yes, the cars are going to move around a lot more and I think that’s cool, I’m all for that. I’m all for having an animal, to a certain degree.

“You want something that’s got grunt, leaves black lines, is moving around, and that’s what they [Supercars] want, and that’s what they’ve achieved I think. We’ll just try find that happy medium.”
Sounds good to me. All we need now is news that we will stay with the stick shift which will make the drivers have to work even harder... :fingers: :fingers:

Testing continues tomorrow with different drivers.....Feeney will drive the Camaro in the morning before Erebus Motorsport’s Will Brown has his first laps of the track in the prototype this afternoon. Not sure who is penned in to drive the Ford.

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Post by Everso Biggyballies » 4 months ago

Goddard compares Gen3 Mustang, Camaro prototypes

That headline is a bit more meaningful than it sounds.....

Zane Goddard’s status as a free agent (he has no full time or any gig locked in at the moment so is not tied to either Ford or GM)) has given him the rare opportunity to test both of Supercars’ Gen3 prototypes from Ford and Chevrolet.

Goddard proved to be an important player in the test, getting a back-to-back read on the two prototypes, the only person in that situation. One thing he has been able to point out from having driven both is the comparative lack of visibility in the Camaro....

This is what he had to say
“Firstly, they’re actually quite similar,” Goddard explained.

“Obviously they’re the same base, it’s just a different aero package. Engines are obviously different as well, you notice that a little bit.

“They both definitely feel like they’ve got reduced downforce compared to the current [Gen2] car, so that’s a tick.

“The way the engines are sort of running at the moment, they’re performing a little bit differently in different areas. You can definitely notice that as a driver.

“One has more torque down low, one has more torque higher in the revs. Just little things like that. But obviously it’s only early days, so that’s all getting closer and closer by the day.

“With the aero, there’s a little bit of a difference in balance. One sort of favours oversteer [Mustang], one favours understeer [Camaro] a bit more, but nothing you can’t tune out of the car.

“There’s still a little bit of adjustability on the rear wing, so playing around with that can sort that out. It’s all just fine-tuning stuff.

“If they just rolled them out straight away and they were exactly the same I think everyone would have been surprised.

“This is planned for. They’re expected to be a little bit different but they’re very close. I don’t think it’s going to take much from the categories to make them on par. That’s promising.”

There was one talking point among the drivers who sampled the Camaro that stood out, most noting the lack of visibility.

The Gen3 regulations are such that the silhouette of the race car has to match that of the road car counterpart.

The new Mustang and Camaro have a noticeably smaller glasshouse than their Gen2 predecessors.

Goddard noted the Camaro has slightly smaller windows than the Mustang, with visibility also affected by the styling of the bonnet and nose of the Camaro.

Will Brown and Broc Feeney similarly noted the lack of visibility, making it harder to see inside kerbs.

However, Goddard believes that can be rectified with seating position adjustments.

“Looking out of the cars is slightly different,” Goddard said.

“The Camaro I would say has smaller windows. It’s pretty much what you’d expect; the field of vision is a little bit tighter.

“If you’re in the right seating position it’s fine. If you’re a little bit low, the bonnet has got a bit more shape to it. That can sort of get in the way.

“For a full-time driver, that should be fine. They’ll put the seat in a position that works.”
Goddard debriefed with the respective Ford and Chevrolet homologation teams, Dick Johnson Racing and Triple Eight Race Engineering, where he gave his feedback.

That, he said, was beneficial to validate his read of the prototypes relative to the other drivers.

“I think it’s good having a driver that can jump between the two,” said Goddard.

“You’re reading between the lines when you’re talking to one driver about one car. When you have someone who can definitively say what the difference is, I think that’s quite beneficial.

“I think it was a good process, I think they [Supercars] learnt a bit from it. I think if that can happen regularly at the test days, I think that’ll be beneficial for the class.”
https://www.speedcafe.com/2022/01/19/go ... rototypes/

Another two days testing at QIR next week (Monday and Tuesday again.)

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Post by Everso Biggyballies » 3 months ago

First time I have seen / heard video of the Gen 3 cars to be introduced this time next year actually being used in anger. From testing at QIR on Monday this week. Apparently 36C on the day. They sound pretty good still. :smiley:


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Post by theracer120 » 3 months ago


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Post by Everso Biggyballies » 3 months ago

theracer120 wrote:
3 months ago
They're keeping the manual :flag:

https://www.supercars.com/news/champion ... -for-gen3/
YES> Great news ...... Common sense and my God a series that listens to the fans and drivers for once. :twothumbs: :drunk: :mates:

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Post by Everso Biggyballies » 3 months ago

Everso Biggyballies wrote:
3 months ago
theracer120 wrote:
3 months ago
They're keeping the manual :flag:

https://www.supercars.com/news/champion ... -for-gen3/
YES> Great news ...... Common sense and my God a series that listens to the fans and drivers for once. :twothumbs: :drunk: :mates:
Interesting to see the post decision poll on Speedcafe of "Did they make the right decision.to stay with stick shift" is 88% Yes with 12% No. So clearly a win for the stay with the stick.

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