Question about Senna's crash at Imola 1994
- LaraCroft2016
- Bronze Member
- Posts: 247
- Joined: 7 years ago
- Real Name: Alice
- Favourite Motorsport: F1, Indycar, Nascar
- Favourite Racing Car: Williams-Renault
- Favourite Driver: Ayrton Senna, Dale Earnhardt
- Favourite Circuit: Daytona, Talladega, Spa
- Car(s) Currently Owned: no
Question about Senna's crash at Imola 1994
Hi, I just read Damon Hill's book and he says "it was a Senna's mistake like it happened with Berger and Piquet" do you agree? the official version says "it was a broken steering column that caused the accident" what do you think?
"The attacks to the twin towers were planned since 1982" Osama Bin Laden in 2004
- MonteCristo
- Moderator
- Posts: 10713
- Joined: 8 years ago
- Favourite Motorsport: Openwheel
- Favourite Racing Car: Tyrrell P34/Protos
- Favourite Driver: JV
- Favourite Circuit: Road America
- Location: Brisbane, Australia
From the last second or so of onboard it looks like the car just went straight. I'd say something broke.
Oscar Piastri in F1! Catch the fever! Vettel Hate Club. Life membership.
2012 GTP Non-Championship Champion | 2012 Guess the Kai-Star Half Marathon Time Champion | 2018 GTP Champion | 2019 GTP Champion
2012 GTP Non-Championship Champion | 2012 Guess the Kai-Star Half Marathon Time Champion | 2018 GTP Champion | 2019 GTP Champion
- kals
- Legendary Member
- Posts: 28276
- Joined: 16 years ago
- Real Name: Kieran
- Favourite Motorsport: F1..BTCC..MotoGP
- Favourite Racing Car: Benetton B189
- Favourite Circuit: Donington Park
- Location: New Jersey
When I have time I'll link a discussion we had a few years back. From memory most of us don't believe the steering broke as Senna appeared to correct a momentary slide through Tamburello. The slide being caused by the car bottoming out due to tyre pressures, hence Damon's comment about Senna making a mistake. Senna takes a very tight line through the corner and strikes a noticeable bump on the circuit, whereas Schumacher is taking a wider line.
- LaraCroft2016
- Bronze Member
- Posts: 247
- Joined: 7 years ago
- Real Name: Alice
- Favourite Motorsport: F1, Indycar, Nascar
- Favourite Racing Car: Williams-Renault
- Favourite Driver: Ayrton Senna, Dale Earnhardt
- Favourite Circuit: Daytona, Talladega, Spa
- Car(s) Currently Owned: no
So, something broke or it was Senna's fault?
"The attacks to the twin towers were planned since 1982" Osama Bin Laden in 2004
- Everso Biggyballies
- Legendary Member
- Posts: 49215
- Joined: 18 years ago
- Real Name: Chris
- Favourite Motorsport: Anything that goes left and right.
- Favourite Racing Car: Too Many to mention
- Favourite Driver: Kimi,Niki,Jim(none called Michael)
- Favourite Circuit: Nordschleife, Spa, Mt Panorama.
- Car(s) Currently Owned: Audi SQ5 3.0L V6 TwinTurbo
- Location: Just moved 3 klms further away so now 11 klms from Albert Park, Melbourne.
There is a multi page thread regarding every aspect of Senna's fatal crash, opinions, beliefs, rumours, possibilities, maybes etc. already HERE on the forum..
* I started life with nothing, and still have most of it left
“Good drivers have dead flies on the side windows!” (Walter Röhrl)
* I married Miss Right. Just didn't know her first name was Always
- Antonov
- Legendary Member
- Posts: 13646
- Joined: 15 years ago
- Real Name: Tobias
- Favourite Motorsport: Formula 1
- Favourite Racing Car: MP4/13 ; F40
- Favourite Driver: M. Hakkinen
- Favourite Circuit: Some shitty street circuit
- Car(s) Currently Owned: VW Golf GTI
- Location: home
I think during the safety car period, tyre pressures dropped resulting in the car riding lower and bottoming out.
The damage to the steering column was probably done on the very first flying lap after the safety car when riding over a bump. When he came round again and hit the same bump, the steering broke and yeah, you know the result.
Anyway, lots of theories out there. Even those saying it was suicide because Senna was unhappy with his family not accepting his girlfriend.
The damage to the steering column was probably done on the very first flying lap after the safety car when riding over a bump. When he came round again and hit the same bump, the steering broke and yeah, you know the result.
Anyway, lots of theories out there. Even those saying it was suicide because Senna was unhappy with his family not accepting his girlfriend.
-
- Elite Member
- Posts: 5269
- Joined: 9 years ago
- Real Name: YouKnowWho
- Favourite Motorsport: F1
Suicide is almost as bonkers as the sniper lunatic on YouTube.
My query is the off board where it looks as though the front left starts steering right as if it's no longer connected.
My query is the off board where it looks as though the front left starts steering right as if it's no longer connected.
Gavle Yule Goat Predictor 2018, 2019 and 2021 Champion
- Antonov
- Legendary Member
- Posts: 13646
- Joined: 15 years ago
- Real Name: Tobias
- Favourite Motorsport: Formula 1
- Favourite Racing Car: MP4/13 ; F40
- Favourite Driver: M. Hakkinen
- Favourite Circuit: Some shitty street circuit
- Car(s) Currently Owned: VW Golf GTI
- Location: home
- kals
- Legendary Member
- Posts: 28276
- Joined: 16 years ago
- Real Name: Kieran
- Favourite Motorsport: F1..BTCC..MotoGP
- Favourite Racing Car: Benetton B189
- Favourite Circuit: Donington Park
- Location: New Jersey
Another discussion here - viewtopic.php?f=80&t=12569Everso Biggyballies wrote: ↑6 years ago There is a multi page thread regarding every aspect of Senna's fatal crash, opinions, beliefs, rumours, possibilities, maybes etc. already HERE on the forum..
- Everso Biggyballies
- Legendary Member
- Posts: 49215
- Joined: 18 years ago
- Real Name: Chris
- Favourite Motorsport: Anything that goes left and right.
- Favourite Racing Car: Too Many to mention
- Favourite Driver: Kimi,Niki,Jim(none called Michael)
- Favourite Circuit: Nordschleife, Spa, Mt Panorama.
- Car(s) Currently Owned: Audi SQ5 3.0L V6 TwinTurbo
- Location: Just moved 3 klms further away so now 11 klms from Albert Park, Melbourne.
Interesting recent video interview with Adrian Newey, the Williams designer of Senna's car in which he "feels responsible" in a way over Senna's death..
'I feel responsible' - Newey emotional on Senna death
'I feel responsible' - Newey emotional on Senna death
* I started life with nothing, and still have most of it left
“Good drivers have dead flies on the side windows!” (Walter Röhrl)
* I married Miss Right. Just didn't know her first name was Always
-
- Bronze Member
- Posts: 156
- Joined: 18 years ago
- Favourite Racing Car: Lotus 98T, Porsche 917
- Favourite Driver: Nigel Mansell
- Favourite Circuit: Brands Hatch
- Car(s) Currently Owned: Alfa 156 V6
- Location: Over the edge
I've always believed the cause of Senna going off the circuit was down to diffuser stall, caused by the ride height being to low on his car from low tyre pressures after running behind the safety car. I had never really believed the broken steering column theory up until this point - I accepted that the column had been modified and had broken during the crash, but had not actually broken while on circuit. However a few days ago I saw a video on Youtube which made me rethink this - its posted by 'saggit76' which I think is 330tr who posts on here sometimes, and is a regular on gpx.it. He has put together some very interesting (and in my opinion, very accurate) computer simulations in the past on Villeneuve and Bandini's shunts. His video below I believe contains the raw onboard camera footage that is available with the overlaid data that was put together by an Italian company for the court trial, but 330tr has added an overlay of the steering wheel at the end of the video to better highlight the movement of the steering wheel just before the camera feed ends. Judge for yourself.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a3xbZBd9SrA
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a3xbZBd9SrA
"I decided i was going to go into it flat, so i did" Nigel Mansell, 1990 Mexican GP
- Michael Ferner
- Senior Member
- Posts: 3531
- Joined: 7 years ago
- Real Name: Michael Ferner
- Favourite Racing Car: Miller '122', McLaren M23
- Favourite Driver: Billy Winn, Bruce McLaren
- Car(s) Currently Owned: None
- Location: Bitburg, Germany
Why did that make you rethink?
2023 'Guess The Pole' Points & Accuracy Champion
If you don't vote now against fascism, you may never have that chance again...
If you don't vote now against fascism, you may never have that chance again...
Ceterum censeo interruptiones essent delendam.
-
- Bronze Member
- Posts: 156
- Joined: 18 years ago
- Favourite Racing Car: Lotus 98T, Porsche 917
- Favourite Driver: Nigel Mansell
- Favourite Circuit: Brands Hatch
- Car(s) Currently Owned: Alfa 156 V6
- Location: Over the edge
Mainly because I had never seen the video highlighting the steering wheel movement before Michael - it sticks out like a sore thumb in my eyes when I see it now, particularly the steering wheel vs. the front left wheel movement.
"I decided i was going to go into it flat, so i did" Nigel Mansell, 1990 Mexican GP
- Everso Biggyballies
- Legendary Member
- Posts: 49215
- Joined: 18 years ago
- Real Name: Chris
- Favourite Motorsport: Anything that goes left and right.
- Favourite Racing Car: Too Many to mention
- Favourite Driver: Kimi,Niki,Jim(none called Michael)
- Favourite Circuit: Nordschleife, Spa, Mt Panorama.
- Car(s) Currently Owned: Audi SQ5 3.0L V6 TwinTurbo
- Location: Just moved 3 klms further away so now 11 klms from Albert Park, Melbourne.
I recall that movement of the wheel was explained plausibly in the National Geographic channel TV documentary on the crash. Having said that I dont recall the exact reason / explanation they gave. It was something along the lines of the stresses and strains transmitted through the wheel at speed were more than enough to account for the movement of the wheel. I seem to recall this was highlighted on another car in a static position showing the wheel does not follow a regular arc as a result of the strains involved at speed.
I am sure it was discussed in one of the other threads mentioned here.
kals wrote: ↑6 years agoAnother discussion here - viewtopic.php?f=80&t=12569Everso Biggyballies wrote: ↑6 years ago There is a multi page thread regarding every aspect of Senna's fatal crash, opinions, beliefs, rumours, possibilities, maybes etc. already HERE on the forum..
* I started life with nothing, and still have most of it left
“Good drivers have dead flies on the side windows!” (Walter Röhrl)
* I married Miss Right. Just didn't know her first name was Always
- Antonov
- Legendary Member
- Posts: 13646
- Joined: 15 years ago
- Real Name: Tobias
- Favourite Motorsport: Formula 1
- Favourite Racing Car: MP4/13 ; F40
- Favourite Driver: M. Hakkinen
- Favourite Circuit: Some shitty street circuit
- Car(s) Currently Owned: VW Golf GTI
- Location: home