The Top Races of the 2010s - THE RESULTS ARE IN! viewtopic.php?p=375104#p375104

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Tin-top racing on death row?

WTCC, BTCC, DTM and Aussie V8s
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Tin-top racing on death row?

Post by John » 2 years ago

Disclaimer: I wasn't sure where to post this. At first I thought I'd stick it in the WTCC/DTM/STCC-thread, but I feel this is more of a discussion of the way forward for tin-tops in general.

https://www.autosport.com/wtcc/news/132 ... tcc-future

WTCC is in dire straits (as if we didn't know that) with no clear path forward, veining factory interest, and a big possibility that Honda opts out and robs the series of it's "World Championship" label as that would effectively leave Volvo has the only factory team. At which point Volvo would probably leave. Read the article above, it's a well-written one. But I'd be surprised if there's a WTCC next year.

Prototype racing is having a hard time as well, especially the WEC, who are trying to salvage things with a two year, eight race season, ending with Le Mans in 2019. Toyota is currently the only manufacturer in the P1 class, but if I were them, I'd probably pack my bags and leave, rather than either racing Le Mans against zero competition and winning, or even worse, have a nightmare of a race and losing against P2 cars.

Everyone's waiting for the new engine regulations to come into play, which makes sense, naturally. Why go through such a huge project to build a new car that will be redundant two years from now? Apparently the "1 km of zero-admission" rule seems to have been scrapped for now, anyway.

Nascar (I feel, without actually checking up the numbers to back this up) are losing interest as well. I kinda feel that this started with the playoff-system, but I might be wrong. Sure, the financial crisis might be to blame as well, but I kind of get the feeling that whenever I turn on the TV and Nascar is on, the seats aren't as full as they used to be.

I don't know what the BTCC is like these days, I've been trying to find some way to follow the series and watch the races online, but to no avail. But I get the feeling that it, at least, is doing somewhat well. Might even be on the way up. The STCC generates next to zero interested in the Swedish press these days, the hoo-haa of the super tourer era is gone. But I still get the feeling that the BTCC is the healthiest of the closed car series in terms of media coverage and race day crowds.

Is racing too diluted these days? Is it too much racing? With F1, support classes, MotoGP, Formula E, WRC, BTCC, WTCC. Nascar, WSBK, you can spend 24 hours a day watching racing. Or is something else to blame? What's the way forward?
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Post by MonteCristo » 2 years ago

Supercars are on shaky ground.
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Post by John » 2 years ago

MonteCristo wrote:
2 years ago
Supercars are on shaky ground.
That too? Oh what the f**k.

Edit: Forgot to rant about DTM nearing it's doomsday as well.
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Post by kals » 2 years ago

WTCC chose a daft route with its formula and is paying the price. BTCC is in good health. DTM will be ok, they've survived with two manufacturers before and will again however if they ever got the joint venture with Japanese GT off the ground it could only be a positive thing. TCR is doing well and appears to be continuing to grow plus showing signs of long term sustainability, but there should always be a place for a Group N or Group N+ type series.

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Post by MonteCristo » 2 years ago

John wrote:
2 years ago
MonteCristo wrote:
2 years ago
Supercars are on shaky ground.
That too? Oh what the f**k.

Edit: Forgot to rant about DTM nearing it's doomsday as well.
It's kind of a perfect storm of factors. Car manufacturing leaving Australia - which is forcing a change in specs (from V8s only), going onto pay TV for many races making the sport inaccessible to many (like F1), leading to teams having more money from pay TV but sponsorship dollars are dropping because of fewer eyeballs.

Far from screwed - but a very turbulent time.
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Post by PTRACER » 2 years ago

I think over-exposure to racing in general is potentially a problem, but for me, BTCC, WTCC etc. have no appeal because the cars seem totally glued to the ground and I haven't heard of 80% of the drivers.
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Post by kals » 2 years ago

PTRACER wrote:
2 years ago
I haven't heard of 80% of the drivers.
Is that BTCC's fault, or indicative of you not following motorsport (and junior series) not as closely anymore? For me it's the latter. Although I like the fact that the BTCC attracts young and relatively unknown drivers. It should. It is part of it's appeal. The only time the series was 80% known drivers was during that insane Super Touring period in the 90s when manufacturers paid big bucks for the best drivers.

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Post by John » 2 years ago

kals wrote:
2 years ago
The only time the series was 80% known drivers was during that insane Super Touring period in the 90s when manufacturers paid big bucks for the best drivers.
*fluttering eyes*

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BTCC had more professional drivers than F1 in 1998.
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Post by PTRACER » 2 weeks ago

PTRACER wrote:
2 years ago
I think over-exposure to racing in general is potentially a problem, but for me, BTCC, WTCC etc. have no appeal because the cars seem totally glued to the ground and I haven't heard of 80% of the drivers.
I still feel this is true. Maybe touring cars could introduce a few special events which attract famous guest drivers. Sportscar racing has plenty and so do the top American series.
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Post by DoubleFart » 1 week ago

The btcc is in a great position. There are big names like Neal and Plato, the manufacturers are backing it, the racing is hard but ultimately fair, and there are so many top quality drivers at the front of the field, plus Tom Chilton.
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Post by Vassago » 1 week ago

DoubleFart wrote:
1 week ago
The btcc is in a great position. There are big names like Neal and Plato, the manufacturers are backing it, the racing is hard but ultimately fair, and there are so many top quality drivers at the front of the field, plus Tom Chilton.
Herein lies the problem, if I go back to watching BTCC then Plato and Neal must get the fuck out! :whistling: For me they are worthless dinosaurs and not big names anymore :bye:
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Post by PTRACER » 1 week ago

Vassago wrote:
1 week ago
DoubleFart wrote:
1 week ago
The btcc is in a great position. There are big names like Neal and Plato, the manufacturers are backing it, the racing is hard but ultimately fair, and there are so many top quality drivers at the front of the field, plus Tom Chilton.
Herein lies the problem, if I go back to watching BTCC then Plato and Neal must get the fuck out! :whistling: For me they are worthless dinosaurs and not big names anymore :bye:
But they're not just grid fillers. They're still winning races and getting podiums.
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Post by Vassago » 1 week ago

PTRACER wrote:
1 week ago
Vassago wrote:
1 week ago
DoubleFart wrote:
1 week ago
The btcc is in a great position. There are big names like Neal and Plato, the manufacturers are backing it, the racing is hard but ultimately fair, and there are so many top quality drivers at the front of the field, plus Tom Chilton.
Herein lies the problem, if I go back to watching BTCC then Plato and Neal must get the fuck out! :whistling: For me they are worthless dinosaurs and not big names anymore :bye:
But they're not just grid fillers. They're still winning races and getting podiums.
This actually speaks bad about the series if such dinosaurs are competitive. Thank God the Mark Blundell Exprience ended the way I expected :roll:

But these guys are getting old fast, I only realized Mat Jackson is almost 40 years old, sheesh.
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Post by DoubleFart » 1 week ago

The slower a car, the longer you'll be competitive. It's not a reflection on this series, it's a reflection of tin top in general.

Is WRC poor because Loeb can still win stages? Was F1 better because Schumacher was less competitive on his return? How about Mansell winning in 1994? Prost and Mansell were both 38 when they won titles in F1...
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Post by erwin greven » 1 week ago

Age doesn't say that much. Speed is not everything. Prost won, like @DoubleFart already mentioned, a title when he was 38. Clever driving, being there when it counts.
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