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1937 Joel Thorne Spectator Accident, Chicago Fairgrounds

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Jesper Hvid
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1937 Joel Thorne Spectator Accident, Chicago Fairgrounds

Post by Jesper Hvid » 9 years ago

http://www.wpafilmlibrary.com/ <--- search: "joel thorne".

Bump when online.
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Post by Jesper Hvid » 1 year ago

It's not online, however:



In the first of two racing scenes, I think this topic title's 1937 accident footage is used.

28:56-28:59 A spin, probably connected to the accident.
28:59-29:00 Bonnet flies off a car, but this is movie material.
29:00-29:01 This is: viewtopic.php?f=7&t=15220&p=324398&hilit=Robson#p324398 . Not important right now.
29:01-29:03 Movie material.
29:03-29:05 Car goes through inside railing, I don't believe this was Joel Thorne.
29:05-29:07 Wheel rolls down mainstretch, maybe not to do with this.
29:07-29:09 Aftermath of accident, Thorne and injured spectator.
29:09-29:10 Movie material.
29:11-29:12 Aftermath of the car that went through railing, not Joel Thorne.
29:12-29:14 Movie material.
29:15-29:18 This is the one that was wrongly described at efootage as the aftermath of Billy Arnold's crash, 1932 Indy 500. https://www.efootage.com/stock-footage/ ... ts_-_1932/ This is of course wrong, but I don't think we ever worked out what it is, and I think THIS is part of the Joel Thorne footage (you can see the car go straight into the spectators, and it matches the movie at 29:07-29:09), plus just before that, another, worse-looking accident, which is probably the car taking a big tumble at 0:29, it is hard to see, and then the following matching aftermath footage.
29:18-29:24 The aftermath of Dick Kroger's fatal crash in 1932, from the efootage archive: https://www.efootage.com/stock-footage/ ... nt_-_1932/ . EDIT<--- NO, Ken Douglas, Langhorne.END EDIT.

Article:

https://www.nytimes.com/1937/06/07/arch ... s-not.html

I haven't got access to the full article. Can you help me, please. It should tell us who the driver in the other big crash involved was, maybe even also the crash through the inside railing.

My suggestion is that all the blue stuff is from the 1937 race when a car crashed violently in front of Joel Thorne, who then to avoid the wreck drove into spectators, and another car went through the inside rail, probably in an unrelated accident.

I'd be glad if we could solve this one, which has been bugging me for a long time.

There is a new Legion Ascot-accident, too, later on in the movie, which I've put in the long-delayed project I'm trying to finalise. More about that hopefully soon.

Moved to identification requests/vintage American section.
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Post by Jesper Hvid » 1 year ago

You only have to read the lines of scribbly black and everything shines.

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Post by Michael Ferner » 1 year ago

Oh, oh... that's a composite of many accidents... where to begin?

Maybe here:
Jesper Hvid wrote:
1 year ago
29:18-29:24 The aftermath of Dick Kroger's fatal crash in 1932, from the efootage archive: https://www.efootage.com/stock-footage/ ... nt_-_1932/ .
That's definitely Langhorne, not Roby, and the date is September 24, 1932. #67 was Ken Douglas, an amateur racer from New York, and it was not fatal.
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Post by Michael Ferner » 1 year ago

Jesper Hvid wrote:
1 year ago
29:15-29:18 This is the one that was wrongly described at efootage as the aftermath of Billy Arnold's crash, 1932 Indy 500. https://www.efootage.com/stock-footage/ ... ts_-_1932/ This is of course wrong, but I don't think we ever worked out what it is, and I think THIS is part of the Joel Thorne footage (you can see the car go straight into the spectators, and it matches the movie at 29:07-29:09), plus just before that, another, worse-looking accident, which is probably the car taking a big tumble at 0:29, it is hard to see, and then the following matching aftermath footage.
This is actually Roby, and it looks very much like the Dick Kroeger accident. I'm sure it's the right event (May 8, 1932), as I recognize #6 and #8, which only raced on that date in that spec at Roby. The car going "into the spectators" must be Bill Brooks, while Kroeger is the "worse-looking accident" and the aftermath.
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Post by Michael Ferner » 1 year ago

Many of the racing scenes are from Ascot, but the crashes around the 29' mark are from several tracks, none of which I can identify in a hurry. Save to say, nothing from Joe Thorne, or 1937.
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Post by Jesper Hvid » 1 year ago

Michael Ferner wrote:
1 year ago
Oh, oh... that's a composite of many accidents... where to begin?

Maybe here:
Jesper Hvid wrote:
1 year ago
29:18-29:24 The aftermath of Dick Kroger's fatal crash in 1932, from the efootage archive: https://www.efootage.com/stock-footage/ ... nt_-_1932/ .
That's definitely Langhorne, not Roby, and the date is September 24, 1932. #67 was Ken Douglas, an amateur racer from New York, and it was not fatal.
I don't remember this discussion: viewtopic.php?f=80&t=9581&p=237407&hili ... er#p237407 , but we apparently dismissed the faux Kroger back then, for the same reasons you specify. What we didn't manage, was to find out which one actually was the Kroger, and I'll have to correct those item titles, and fix the URLs.

We've still nothing from Joel Thorne, so this goes back into requests. I thought I had it, as it all fit, but at least we now have an affirmative on the Kroger crash, which is actually more important than the possible Thorne.
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Post by Jesper Hvid » 1 year ago

The REAL Kroger-accident footage does not have an IDing topic, so apparently that was never attempted.

But to sum up, everything above in blue, plus: https://www.efootage.com/stock-footage/ ... ts_-_1932/ is Dick Kroger's fatal accident at Roby, in 1932. Crash and aftermath is shown.

http://www.motorsportmemorial.org/focus ... =ct&n=3521

[Archived: JH-0065]

So, efootage put the description of Kroger with the accident of Douglas (same year), and the description of Billy Arnold's Indy crash of same year, with the accident of Kroger. Now, you would think that the description of the Douglas would be under the 1932 Indy 500 video, but apparently, there is no video from that, in their archive.

---

Joel Thorne's 1937-accident is still of interest, and this topic is moved back to requests, to be updated when online, from the WPA-library.
You only have to read the lines of scribbly black and everything shines.

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