Join us here in ranking Ayrton Senna's Formula 1 cars! viewtopic.php?f=32&t=16038

Underrated F1 cars

Racing events, drivers, cars or anything else from the past.
Post Reply
User avatar
Antonov
I am Stefan GP
I am Stefan GP
Posts: 11539
Joined: 10 years ago
Real Name: Tobias
Favourite Motorsport: Formula 1
Favourite Racing Car: MP4/13 ; F40
Favourite Driver: M. Hakkinen
Favourite Circuit: Some shitty street circuit
Car(s) Currently Owned: VW Golf GTI
Location: home

Underrated F1 cars

Post by Antonov » 9 months ago

We have underrated drivers (eg. kazuki nakajima, stefano modena, damon ill, tora takagi,...)
But there are also cars described as bad, which were actually not all that bad when you look at it.

Two examples, in my opinion at least, from the Prancing Horse:
Image
1996 Ferrari (F310)

Image
2012 Ferrari (F2012)

For McLaren, the 'Truck' procduced results the team could only dream of these days
Image
1995 McLaren (MP4/10)

For Williams, the 1998 car was obviously not in the same league as the 1997 car.
But I feel that the two unmotivated drivers probably held it back more than it should have.
Image
1998 Williams (FW20)

User avatar
Everso Biggyballies
Ultimate Member
Ultimate Member
Posts: 25246
Joined: 13 years ago
Real Name: Chris
Favourite Motorsport: Anything that goes left and right.
Favourite Racing Car: Too Many to mention
Favourite Driver: Raikkonen, Lauda, Clark etc
Favourite Circuit: Nordschleife, Spa, Mt Panorama.
Car(s) Currently Owned: BMW 330C M Sport Coupe
Location: 8 kms from Albert Park, Melbourne.

Post by Everso Biggyballies » 9 months ago

Antonov wrote:
9 months ago

For Williams, the 1998 car was obviously not in the same league as the 1997 car.
But I feel that the two unmotivated drivers probably held it back more than it should have.
Image
1998 Williams (FW20)
Surely the biggest change and influence from 1997 to 1998 was the loss of works Renault engines, replaced with the Mecachrome version.

*My woman cant wrestle. But you should see her box!*


*I married Miss Right. Just didn't know her first name was Always

User avatar
Antonov
I am Stefan GP
I am Stefan GP
Posts: 11539
Joined: 10 years ago
Real Name: Tobias
Favourite Motorsport: Formula 1
Favourite Racing Car: MP4/13 ; F40
Favourite Driver: M. Hakkinen
Favourite Circuit: Some shitty street circuit
Car(s) Currently Owned: VW Golf GTI
Location: home

Post by Antonov » 9 months ago

Which in essence was the very competitive 1997 Renault engine

User avatar
Everso Biggyballies
Ultimate Member
Ultimate Member
Posts: 25246
Joined: 13 years ago
Real Name: Chris
Favourite Motorsport: Anything that goes left and right.
Favourite Racing Car: Too Many to mention
Favourite Driver: Raikkonen, Lauda, Clark etc
Favourite Circuit: Nordschleife, Spa, Mt Panorama.
Car(s) Currently Owned: BMW 330C M Sport Coupe
Location: 8 kms from Albert Park, Melbourne.

Post by Everso Biggyballies » 9 months ago

A bit like saying the engine Sauber had in 2017 was great in 2016. A year without development is a long tiime in F1The Mercedes engine in 1988 had an extra 40bhp over their 1987 engine,

*My woman cant wrestle. But you should see her box!*


*I married Miss Right. Just didn't know her first name was Always

User avatar
kals
Forum Administrator
Forum Administrator
Posts: 27528
Joined: 11 years ago
Real Name: Kieran
Favourite Motorsport: F1..BTCC..MotoGP
Favourite Racing Car: Benetton B189
Favourite Circuit: Donington Park
Location: New Jersey

Post by kals » 9 months ago

Everso Biggyballies wrote:
9 months ago
Antonov wrote:
9 months ago

For Williams, the 1998 car was obviously not in the same league as the 1997 car.
But I feel that the two unmotivated drivers probably held it back more than it should have.
Image
1998 Williams (FW20)
Surely the biggest change and influence from 1997 to 1998 was the loss of works Renault engines, replaced with the Mecachrome version.
Power wasn’t that much less than Ferrari and Mercedes, Mechachrome didn’t do a too bad job. The car was the weak spot. Williams were woefully unprepared for the new rules, which was odd considering how much they tested a 1998-spec car in 1997.

As for it underrated? Not a chance. It was crap.

I also disagree with the 2012 Ferrari, how was it underrated? Please explain.

If you want to talk underrated then let’s dig deeper and not go for the obvious...

For example, the Footwork FA13 from 1992. Off the back of an awful 1991 season Jackie Oliver’s squad came up with a neat chassis and coupled it to a great Mugen-Honda engine. In the hands of Michele Alboreto it scored points four times and also went on a remarkable run of 9 successive races where it finished in the points or in 7th place, bar one race where he finished 9th.

User avatar
Antonov
I am Stefan GP
I am Stefan GP
Posts: 11539
Joined: 10 years ago
Real Name: Tobias
Favourite Motorsport: Formula 1
Favourite Racing Car: MP4/13 ; F40
Favourite Driver: M. Hakkinen
Favourite Circuit: Some shitty street circuit
Car(s) Currently Owned: VW Golf GTI
Location: home

Post by Antonov » 9 months ago

The F2012 scored pole positions (Hockenheim?) and several wins.
because of its weird looks, people assumed it was slow. It was not, or rather, development of the car made it decent.

User avatar
kals
Forum Administrator
Forum Administrator
Posts: 27528
Joined: 11 years ago
Real Name: Kieran
Favourite Motorsport: F1..BTCC..MotoGP
Favourite Racing Car: Benetton B189
Favourite Circuit: Donington Park
Location: New Jersey

Post by kals » 9 months ago

Antonov wrote:
9 months ago
The F2012 scored pole positions (Hockenheim?) and several wins.
because of its weird looks, people assumed it was slow. It was not, or rather, development of the car made it decent.
It was a car that challenged for the title and won races. That’s not underrated. And besides, every car in 2012 looked weird.

Same goes for Schumi’s 1996 car. He took multiple poles and wins using it. That’s not the definition of underrated.

User avatar
Antonov
I am Stefan GP
I am Stefan GP
Posts: 11539
Joined: 10 years ago
Real Name: Tobias
Favourite Motorsport: Formula 1
Favourite Racing Car: MP4/13 ; F40
Favourite Driver: M. Hakkinen
Favourite Circuit: Some shitty street circuit
Car(s) Currently Owned: VW Golf GTI
Location: home

Post by Antonov » 9 months ago

kals wrote:
9 months ago
Antonov wrote:
9 months ago
The F2012 scored pole positions (Hockenheim?) and several wins.
because of its weird looks, people assumed it was slow. It was not, or rather, development of the car made it decent.
It was a car that challenged for the title and won races. That’s not underrated. And besides, every car in 2012 looked weird.

Same goes for Schumi’s 1996 car. He took multiple poles and wins using it. That’s not the definition of underrated.
it is however if you hear people (Edmund Irvine) describe it as a piece of junk.

User avatar
Everso Biggyballies
Ultimate Member
Ultimate Member
Posts: 25246
Joined: 13 years ago
Real Name: Chris
Favourite Motorsport: Anything that goes left and right.
Favourite Racing Car: Too Many to mention
Favourite Driver: Raikkonen, Lauda, Clark etc
Favourite Circuit: Nordschleife, Spa, Mt Panorama.
Car(s) Currently Owned: BMW 330C M Sport Coupe
Location: 8 kms from Albert Park, Melbourne.

Post by Everso Biggyballies » 9 months ago

Antonov wrote:
9 months ago
kals wrote:
9 months ago
Antonov wrote:
9 months ago
The F2012 scored pole positions (Hockenheim?) and several wins.
because of its weird looks, people assumed it was slow. It was not, or rather, development of the car made it decent.
It was a car that challenged for the title and won races. That’s not underrated. And besides, every car in 2012 looked weird.

Same goes for Schumi’s 1996 car. He took multiple poles and wins using it. That’s not the definition of underrated.
it is however if you hear people (Edmund Irvine) describe it as a piece of junk.
That's more an indictment of Irvines inabilities. :wink:
A bad workman blames his tools seems appropriate.
Four points finishes and scraping just into the top 10 in the title race with a massively unimpressive 11 points for the year. (against Schu's 3 wins, 3 seconds and 8 podiums.

*My woman cant wrestle. But you should see her box!*


*I married Miss Right. Just didn't know her first name was Always

User avatar
kals
Forum Administrator
Forum Administrator
Posts: 27528
Joined: 11 years ago
Real Name: Kieran
Favourite Motorsport: F1..BTCC..MotoGP
Favourite Racing Car: Benetton B189
Favourite Circuit: Donington Park
Location: New Jersey

Post by kals » 9 months ago

Antonov wrote:
9 months ago
kals wrote:
9 months ago
Antonov wrote:
9 months ago
The F2012 scored pole positions (Hockenheim?) and several wins.
because of its weird looks, people assumed it was slow. It was not, or rather, development of the car made it decent.
It was a car that challenged for the title and won races. That’s not underrated. And besides, every car in 2012 looked weird.

Same goes for Schumi’s 1996 car. He took multiple poles and wins using it. That’s not the definition of underrated.
it is however if you hear people (Edmund Irvine) describe it as a piece of junk.
So why does that make that car underrated?

Your three nominations in this thread make no sense.

@Everso Biggyballies, Irvine was the definitive number 2 driver in 1996. Only Schumacher was allowed testing time, he had preference for chassIs and upgrades. When Irvine was doing well he’d get involved in something not of his own sound...i.e. Panis at Monaco or Berger at Suzuka.

Post Reply