The COVID British Grand Prix - Round 4

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Re: The COVID British Grand Prix - Round 4

Post by White six » 1 month ago

Latest post of the previous page:

Three front left failures wasn't it? Debris my arse

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Post by Star » 1 month ago

With those tyre failures, plus the likelihood of a hotter race and pirelli bringing softer tyres this coming weekend, it could be a race of more pitstops than usual, just in case.
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Post by caneparo » 1 month ago

Star wrote:
1 month ago
With those tyre failures, plus the likelihood of a hotter race and pirelli bringing softer tyres this coming weekend, it could be a race of more pitstops than usual, just in case.
Not sure that will create issues. Otherwise it will obligate the teams to a double stopper
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Post by Ruslan » 1 month ago

Star wrote:
1 month ago
With those tyre failures, plus the likelihood of a hotter race and pirelli bringing softer tyres this coming weekend, it could be a race of more pitstops than usual, just in case.
Yea, it does sound like a two-stop strategy is in order, even if a one-stopper is faster.

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Post by Everso Biggyballies » 1 month ago

Ruslan wrote:
1 month ago
Star wrote:
1 month ago
With those tyre failures, plus the likelihood of a hotter race and pirelli bringing softer tyres this coming weekend, it could be a race of more pitstops than usual, just in case.
Yea, it does sound like a two-stop strategy is in order, even if a one-stopper is faster.
The thing with Silverstone is that if it comes to multiple stops it is the least penalising stop of the year just about.... just under 20 seconds total time IIRC.

I expect Pirelli will mandate higher tyre pressure minimums to help. Pirelli have put the failures last weekend down to a badly timed SC (after 12 laps which forced teams to roll the dice on a 40 lap stint on a known heavy on tyres circuit. They discounted debris from the collapsed nose on Raikkonen's car as being contributory. Sounds like Pirelli handballing any blame onto the teams for pushing the envelope too far.
Pirelli has announced the British Grand Prix tyre failures were caused by the unusually long stints that were run on the hard compounds during the race.

Both Mercedes drivers and McLaren's Carlos Sainz Jr sustained front-left tyre punctures during the final laps of last weekend's British GP, with Lewis Hamilton winning the race on three wheels after his tyre failed with half a lap to go, as both Bottas and Sainz dropped out of the points after their late stops.

Pirelli Formula 1 boss Mario Isola suggested after the race on Sunday the unexpectedly long second stints could be a key factor to the late failures, while the "biggest forces ever seen on tyres" in F1 was also a contributing factor.

PLUS: Why Silverstone is "not friends" with tyres

Every driver except Romain Grosjean and Alex Albon pitted on lap 12 or 13 during the second safety car period, triggered by Daniil Kvyat's crash that co-incidentally was because of a right-rear puncture, to reach the finish of the 52-lap race on the hard tyres.

"The key reason is down to a set of individual race circumstances that led to an extremely long use of the second set of tyres," the Pirelli report confirmed.

"The second safety car period prompted nearly all the teams to anticipate their planned pit stop and so carry out a particularly long final stint: around 40 laps, which is more than three-quarters the total race length on one of the most demanding tracks of the calendar.

"Combined with the notably increased pace of the 2020 Formula 1 cars (pole position was 1.2 seconds faster compared to 2019) this made the final laps of the British Grand Prix especially tough, as a consequence of the biggest forces ever seen on tyres generated by the fastest Formula 1 cars in history.



"The overall result was the most challenging operating conditions for tyres. These led to the front-left tyre (which is well-known for working hardest at Silverstone) being placed under maximum stress after a very high number of laps, with the resulting high wear meaning that it was less protected from the extreme forces in play."

Pirelli will stick with its original plan to go one step softer for this weekend's 70th Anniversary GP at Silverstone, with the C2, C3 and C4 in use, without the hardest C1 compound.

However, it is likely to mandate higher minimum pressures as a safety precaution.

There was no mention of debris as a contributing factor, despite speculation that Kimi Raikkonen's late front wing failure could have played a role.
https://www.autosport.com/f1/news/15105 ... e-failures

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Post by MonteCristo » 1 month ago

To be fair to Pirelli, there have been countless occasions in the last few years where tyres were only meant to last say 25 laps, and then some drove around on them for 40.

So it's probably a bit of both the teams pushing and the tyres being crap.
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Post by Star » 1 month ago

They're already dropping the temperatures in the forecast for Sunday, it's down to 24C but still dry with a mixture of sunshine and cloud, so similar to last weekend. After the tyre failures I'd be more inclined to make more stops myself, but then I'm probably over cautious.
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Post by Everso Biggyballies » 1 month ago

Pirelli are going to mandate an increase of both front and rear tyre pressures to help overcome problems.... it seems last week tyres pressures dropped too far under SC conditions and led to problems at the restarts, causing undue stress on the front lefts as the cars headed into the fast right hander after the start finish straight..

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Post by MiÑardi » 1 month ago

It does look like identical weather to last weekend, so far. Very hot on Friday. Fairly warm on Saturday, and then a bit cooler on race day. Hopefully that changes and we get a bit of rain or a heatwave on Sunday to mix things up a litte.

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Post by Ruslan » 1 month ago

Everso Biggyballies wrote:
1 month ago
Pirelli are going to mandate an increase of both front and rear tyre pressures to help overcome problems.... it seems last week tyres pressures dropped too far under SC conditions and led to problems at the restarts, causing undue stress on the front lefts as the cars headed into the fast right hander after the start finish straight..
Didn't they have the similar problem and solution a couple of years back? Teams were running the tires underinflated and Pirelli was forced to insist they operate at a minimum pressure?

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Post by SB83 » 1 month ago

Yes, I think they were running too much camber perhaps instead of too low pressure...or both. I say that because I remember there being a maximum camber rule put in place at the following race which I think was Spa.

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Post by DoubleFart » 1 month ago

2013. Massa, Perez and Hamilton all had failures, plus a Toro Rosso. Alonso had an actual puncture so not related.
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Post by Ruslan » 1 month ago

SB83 wrote:
1 month ago
Yes, I think they were running too much camber perhaps instead of too low pressure...or both. I say that because I remember there being a maximum camber rule put in place at the following race which I think was Spa.
Yea, I get fuzzy on the details. I guess Pirelli needs to remind the teams what the design parameters of the tires are. Is it really Pirelli's fault if they run the tire for longer than it is designed for?

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Post by Everso Biggyballies » 1 month ago

Ruslan wrote:
1 month ago
SB83 wrote:
1 month ago
Yes, I think they were running too much camber perhaps instead of too low pressure...or both. I say that because I remember there being a maximum camber rule put in place at the following race which I think was Spa.
Yea, I get fuzzy on the details. I guess Pirelli needs to remind the teams what the design parameters of the tires are. Is it really Pirelli's fault if they run the tire for longer than it is designed for?
It (stint length) is also i would think a complete variable that would be different dependent on fuel load, driver style, strategy (we know they dont run at 100% all the time) and then also we get into the complexities of car set up, camber, tyre pressures, toe in etc etc. Pirelli cant be expected to provide a recommended stint level to cover all the variables... particularly given some teams push the set up / tyre pressure envelope closer to the wind than others might. Not to mention toys like DAS.

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Post by SB83 » 1 month ago

Everso Biggyballies wrote:
1 month ago
Ruslan wrote:
1 month ago
SB83 wrote:
1 month ago
Yes, I think they were running too much camber perhaps instead of too low pressure...or both. I say that because I remember there being a maximum camber rule put in place at the following race which I think was Spa.
Yea, I get fuzzy on the details. I guess Pirelli needs to remind the teams what the design parameters of the tires are. Is it really Pirelli's fault if they run the tire for longer than it is designed for?
It (stint length) is also i would think a complete variable that would be different dependent on fuel load, driver style, strategy (we know they dont run at 100% all the time) and then also we get into the complexities of car set up, camber, tyre pressures, toe in etc etc. Pirelli cant be expected to provide a recommended stint level to cover all the variables... particularly given some teams push the set up / tyre pressure envelope closer to the wind than others might. Not to mention toys like DAS.

Yea, agree with both of you. There's probably no way a tyre manufacturer can account for every trick a team throws at it and at some point, you have to let the teams take responsibility. If it were a case like Indy 2005 then I can see it being the tyre manufacturer's responsibility but not otherwise.

Last week's blowouts I'm sure were down to almost every driver dipping their LF wheel on the runoff at the turn leading on to the Hangar Straight, and cutting their tyre on the edge of the track where the grass starts. It's no coincidence they extended that runoff this week before the 70th anniversary race.

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Post by erwin greven » 1 month ago

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