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Re: Williams.... Where to from here?

Posted: Tue Nov 06, 2018 15:04 pm
by Everso Biggyballies

Latest post of the previous page:

Is Sirotkin defitely out? Ocon in? or AN Other with a budget.

I have heard of the possibility that might see BWT transferring their sponsorship from FI to Williams to help fund Ocon driving there but have heard no confirmation. Have I missed something?

Re: Williams.... Where to from here?

Posted: Tue Nov 06, 2018 15:14 pm
by kals
Everso Biggyballies wrote:
1 year ago
Is Sirotkin defitely out? Ocon in? or AN Other with a budget.
Ocon hasn’t been confirmed, only Russell. What is believed is that there is little to no chance Sirotkin will stay on.
Everso Biggyballies wrote:
1 year ago
I have heard of the possibility that might see BWT transferring their sponsorship from FI to Williams to help fund Ocon driving there but have heard no confirmation. Have I missed something?
I haven’t read anything about that. That would be good if true.

Re: Williams.... Where to from here?

Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2018 16:05 pm
by Vassago
Williams has reached the levels of hamster spinning on a pay-driver wheel. They're dead last in the pecking order so to improve their budgets they have to sign mediocre talent with cash but these very same drivers will keep the team in the cellar. Someone like Ocon would really tell how bad the car really is (or not). Meanwhile I hope Perez spanks Stroll's ass at F.I. :tongue:

Re: Williams.... Where to from here?

Posted: Sun Nov 11, 2018 00:30 am
by Everso Biggyballies
Vassago wrote:
1 year ago
Meanwhile I hope Perez spanks Stroll's ass at F.I. :tongue:

Sirotkin managed to spank Stroll at Williams in qualy so I see no problem for Perez. Unless he gets all the dud bits and Stroll gets first go with the developments.

Re: Williams.... Where to from here?

Posted: Tue Feb 19, 2019 11:07 am
by Everso Biggyballies
We all know the fact that Williams were not at day 1 of testing and not likely to be at day 2 and that day 3 is looking a challenge....

Rumours have started to fly about Paddy Lowe's future in the team with rumours he has offered his resignation denied with a no comment response from Williams. However it has been backed up with stories of late actions and decisions leading to the late go ahead on critical parts. Certainly morale at Grove is not in a good place with the workforce being made to work huge hours because of the poor management. A Williams insider has said a few things...
Williams insider - "missing testing is purely from waiting too long to release parts...and"

I've spoken with three Williams personnel (two are trackside, one is factory based) and here are the facts about missing T1:

Parts were 'released' too late to be manufactured on-time and that's the only reason we're missing T1 D1. The missing parts are composite so they are possibly suspension or bodywork related but I wasn't told exactly...and didn't ask. When she/he said the parts were not 'released', they mean the part was not approved and sent out as a full scale model which is then taken to the composite laminators or machining group for manufacture.

Overall morale in the team is "low as f...". "We're being worked like dogs, treated like shit, and HR is a fucking joke"

"We're often wondering who's in charge around here" ... eadership/

Is this an issue caused by Paddy Lowe, or is it indeed something further up the ladder and a criticism of Claire Williams?
Tough times ahead for Williams, who were looking to right the wrongs and performance of last year.

Re: Williams.... Where to from here?

Posted: Thu Mar 07, 2019 04:38 am
by Everso Biggyballies
With the news that Paddy Lowe is on temporary leave, the questions will be asked if he is ever coming back, and did he walk or was he pushed.
Technically he has not actually quit but has gone on unspecified leave of absence. Whether he can be persuaded to return of course is another question. Did he quit and then Williams ask him to just take a couple of weeks off to reconsider. It seems like it is a failed relationship, but is it the situation at Williams or a clash of two people..

The tricky bit is It is not like leaving an employer in his case because part of his deal was to become a fully fledged shareholder and therefore part owner of the business. Then again so was Ron Dennis, and with him he owned more of McLaren than the small amount of Williams Paddy Lowe does. Be interesting to see how they go in Aus.

A poor performance will be the final straw I would say. A good one and who knows. Maybe Paddy will say ok this isnt that bad. If he leaves it is going to be a tough road for Williams to replace Paddy. Is it an internal politics thing? Maybe Paddy was offered a free hand by Clare, but the reality has turned out he has his hands tied in decisions. Might it be a Clare and Paddy impasse. Maybe Clare needs to step back from the Principal role.

Interesting days / weeks ahead for Williams. An ordinary driver pairing with it being the blind leading the blind, with Russell in my mnd likely to be the faster of the two but lacking any development experience, and Kubica lacking anything relevant in terms of recent experience or development skills. Plus he is already bleating about only being 20% ready. Hardly the talk of a supposed team leader.

I would hate to see them go further downhill or quit racing and remain as an engineering company, but the future is one of great uncertainty. I wish them all the very best of luck and hope they pull through. The Williams team in one guise or another have been around in F1 pretty much from when I started watching, and I have always had a soft spot for the team.

Re: Williams.... Where to from here?

Posted: Fri Mar 29, 2019 16:48 pm
by Everso Biggyballies
Patrick Head returns as a consultant.

He will sort them out. They have gone downhill from the moment he left.
The 2019 campaign has been a sobering one for Williams, but in a bid to transform their fortunes, the iconic British team have tempted co-founder Sir Patrick Head to return to Grove to support the engineering team in a consultancy capacity…

Head has legendary status within the team, so his return is something of a coup. Having founded the team with owner Sir Frank Williams in 1976, the Briton - who remains a shareholder - was the pioneering spearhead of the squad's design department.

As both Technical Director and later Director of Engineering he helped guide the team to seven drivers’ championships and nine constructors' titles before stepping away from the outfit in 2011.

Since then, Williams have enjoyed mixed fortunes, securing just one Grand Prix win but two third-place finishes in the constructors’ championship. Currently, they lie last in the standings, having finished in that position last year, and have a car that is well off the pace.

With their Chief Technical Officer Paddy Lowe having taken a leave of absence for personal reasons, Head’s return in this capacity, even if it’s only short-term, offers stability.

Williams told in a statement: “We can confirm that Sir Patrick Head is currently offering some support to our engineering team on a short-term consultancy basis.”

Lawrence Barretto, Senior Writer says:
“This is a huge statement of intent for Williams, who have endured a miserable start to the season. Last year was painful enough, but to miss their shakedown as well as two-and-a-half days of testing and then see that the car is well off the pace was brutal.

"Aside from Sir Frank Williams himself, there is no one who knows Williams, and understands them, better. He is obviously still a shareholder, so has always had an active interest in the team over the years. He regularly visits Grove, too, so drafting him in at a time when Williams needs stability is a strong move.

"There will be great respect for him within Grove and while the staff remain motivated and loyal to the team, his arrival will certainly help add an extra boost as well as give them clear direction." ... wYD7N.html

Re: Williams.... Where to from here?

Posted: Fri Mar 29, 2019 18:20 pm
by kals
Everso Biggyballies wrote:
9 months ago
Patrick Head returns as a consultant.

He will sort them out. They have gone downhill from the moment he left.
Apart from 2014 and 2015 :whistling:

Re: Williams.... Where to from here?

Posted: Fri Mar 29, 2019 19:21 pm
by John
The aero game will be a crap shoot when the old guard finally decides to leave and the youngins' have to get this done on their own.

Re: Williams.... Where to from here?

Posted: Fri Apr 05, 2019 16:41 pm
by Everso Biggyballies
Williams in profit....

For all their on track woes Williams continue to make money through peripheral businesses and a large chunk of FIA 'History' benefits.
The Williams Formula 1 team posted solid financial results in 2018, despite a poor performance on track leading to the Grove outfit tumbling to last in the constructors' championship.
Figures announced on Friday showed that both the F1 team and its sister company Williams Advanced Engineering generated increased revenue compared to 2017, although EBITDA [earnings before interest, taxes, depreciation and amortisation] remained at similar levels for both.

Revenue at the F1 team was up from £125.6m to £130.7m, with earnings remaining stable at £16.0m.

The team earned income from the F1 organisation based on its the fifth places it posted in the previous two seasons, while its financial performance was "supported by non-recurring one-off item".

Williams CEO Mike O'Driscoll admitted that the team has been through some tough times, and made it clear that hopes are resting on the changes Liberty is planning for 2021, and which are in large part intended to help midfield teams to compete.

"Our F1 team had high expectations that we could build on four years of very solid performance in the FIA Constructors' Championship," said O'Driscoll.

"But unfortunately, we struggled to maintain the pace of technical development and endured a difficult season.

"There is a very large gap in competitive expenditure between the leading teams and the rest of the grid, but we are increasingly hopeful that Liberty Media's long-term vision and plans for the future of the sport can deliver a more level playing field on which all teams can compete fairly.

"In the meantime, we are intensely focused on improving our own performance, following a tough start to this season's campaign."

The departure of title sponsor Martini, the loss of backing associated with 2018 drivers Lance Stroll and Sergey Sirotkin, and the reduced F1 income triggered by last year's tumble to 10th place and what looks likely to be repeat in 2019 are all set to have an impact on this year's financial performance.

However, O'Driscoll stressed that the team has attracted new support: "We were delighted to commence a new title partnership with ROKiT and to welcome Orlen to our partner community for 2019, demonstrating the continued strength of the Williams brand."

The engineering business saw a rise in revenue from £39.5m to £44.8m, with a small rise in earnings from £5.0 to £5.1m. O'Driscoll noted: "We continued to invest in both our people and technical capabilities. Our expertise in electrification and lightweight material technology provides an excellent foundation for future growth."
To me it confirms the error in the way teams are currently rewarded by Liberty under the Concorde.

Reading between the lines it does not bode well for Williams financially next year which will be when their lack of pay drivers and sponsorship will bite.... I know Martini was not a huge financial sponsorship but I would think Rokit is not a big spender either..... unless SFW negotiated a healthy contract breaking payout for the Stroll set up, which of course was contracted to continue but was terminated by the Stroll / Force India buyout.

Re: Williams.... Where to from here?

Posted: Tue Sep 10, 2019 10:29 am
by Everso Biggyballies
Surprise surprise..... Williams F1 lost a heap of money this financial year.

I dont think they are going broke though as the engineering group is posting bigger profits and revenue. However the overall Group still lost money.
At least they still have RKs Orlen sponsorshp coming in, although presumably at year end that will disappear along with Robert.

Next year wont be easy either with F1 income set again to be based on 10th position in the WCC.
The Williams Formula 1 team has posted a significant financial loss for the first six months of 2019 as it pays the price for its poor performance last season.
The team tumbled from fifth to 10th in the world championship, which has led to a drop in this year's income from the F1 organisation.

In addition, it has lost the income associated with drivers Lance Stroll and Sergey Sirotkin, as well as previous title sponsor Martini.

However, it has gained a new title sponsor in ROKiT, as well as Orlen sponsorship from Robert Kubica.

Nevertheless, the F1 team generated revenue of just £46.3m in January-June, compared with £60.7m last season, generating an EBITDA [earnings before interest, tax, depreciation and amortisation] loss of £16.8m, after posting a profit of £0.2m in the same period last year.

The F1 figures were offset in part by an improved performance for sister company Williams Advanced Engineering, which increased its revenue from £21.5m to £30.9m.

Total combined revenue for parent company Williams Grand Prix Holdings fell from £82.6m to £77.8m, with the overall EBITDA loss increasing from £2.7m to £18.8m.

"Our financial results reflect a challenging half year for our F1 operations, yet also demonstrated continued growth in the Williams Advanced Engineering business," said group CEO Mike O'Driscoll.

"The F1 financial results primarily reflect our finishing position in last year's Constructors' Championship and the consequent reduction in prize money (which is paid a year in arrears).

"There was also an overall reduction in partnership income compared to the first half of 2018, although we secured major new partnerships with ROKiT and Orlen.

"Although we are enduring another tough season on track, we have seen some recent signs of improvement, and we continue to attract interest from potential partners as one of the longest standing Formula 1 teams.

"This is best demonstrated by the recent two-year extension to our title partnership deal with ROKiT who will now continue with us until at least 2023."

Williams will clearly take another big hit on F1 income next year as it heads for a second successive 10th place in the championship.

However, O'Driscoll remains bullish about future prospects, stressing the importance of the 2021 regulations.

"Negotiations with Formula One management and Liberty Media regarding the future of the sport from 2021 have been productive and we believe, when finalised, will represent a much-needed opportunity for Williams to benefit from a more level financial playing field, as well as new technical regulations."

He added: "Although we continue to face challenges in a very dynamic environment, we currently believe the majority of the impact on EBITDA for the full year has already been captured in these interim results.

"We continue to believe we are well placed to respond to the challenges ahead, with world class facilities and a strong and talented organisation." ... s/4537659/

Re: Williams.... Where to from here?

Posted: Tue Sep 10, 2019 20:51 pm
by DoubleFart
Skim read the article, didn't see a mention that they're looking to sell of a percentage of the engineering business.

Re: Williams.... Where to from here?

Posted: Tue Sep 10, 2019 22:56 pm
by Picci
Looks like even if they posted the same revenue as last year they would still have made a small loss.

I think Williams need to look at some of the other teams around them and really understand what they're doing with a comparable budget. Force India were not renowned for having a big budget. Their engine is the same as Williams' and they performed much better. This year one could say that they have a bigger budget with Mr Stroll's money but still.

To be perfectly honest, I think their biggest weakness is the lack of engineering talent. They always have the same three people running the show and you don't really get to hear of any fresh blood coming in to change things around.

Re: Williams.... Where to from here?

Posted: Tue Sep 10, 2019 23:29 pm
by erwin greven
Picci wrote:
4 months ago

To be perfectly honest, I think their biggest weakness is the lack of engineering talent. They always have the same three people running the show and you don't really get to hear of any fresh blood coming in to change things around.
They really need to attract some engineering talent, yes. When using a Mercedes engine, you can only come to the conclusion that the chassis is not functioning.

Same thing that Ferrari is suffering from, to a lesser extent.

Re: Williams.... Where to from here?

Posted: Wed Sep 11, 2019 02:29 am
by Vassago
I can only wonder how much Michael Latifi is willing to spend on his son's career but that would be way more than Orlen did for Kubica. Nothing like private money where you don't have to report to anyone over spending it. I wouldn't be surprised if M.Latifi became a full-time share-holder in Williams so his son occupies the seat for years to come (unless he takes it elsewhere but with so many manufacturer teams I don't think he will have another choice unless Haas suddenly goes belly up).

I mean Latifi "invested" 200m pounds to become a 10% shareholder with McLaren Group last year and Nicky boy didn't come close to sniffing a race seat there. This is taking pay driving into a whole new level.

Re: Williams.... Where to from here?

Posted: Fri Sep 13, 2019 22:10 pm
by Everso Biggyballies
Mercedes obviously have faith in their (Williams) survival.... they have just signed an engine deal to supply Williams until at least 2025. That is well into the new regs era. New rules planned for 2021 are aimed at making the grid more competitive. AFAIK a budget cap has already been agreed, while new technical rules to allow closer racing are being finalised before teams and the sport's bosses move on to agreeing a more equitable revenue split.
Toto Wolff wrote:"Williams is one of the iconic brands in F1," said Mercedes motorsport boss Toto Wolff.

"They have been through some tough times recently but that has only served to demonstrate their resilience and strength of character as they battle back to where they belong on the grid.

"I am certain that the outlook for independent teams is bright under the financial regulations that will be introduced from 2021 and we are delighted to continue our partnership with Williams into that new era of our sport."
Of course, that is still a couple of years away for Williams to benefit from that. In the short term they have to improve their car performance to earn some FIA/Liberty money