The "Oh, sweet, no Mongols oh goddamnit the Berbers are invading someone get El Cid" GP of Spain

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#181

Post by myownalias »

Bottom post of the previous page:

Just finished watching the race and boy, that was a challenge staying awake.

Hamilton, flawless, Ferrari, bad choices made, even accounting for Perez stopping, it was still a poor call, even without the delayed release, Vettel still lost out on 2nd and 3 points. I can't help but feel a repeat of 2017 on the cards, Ferrari starting strong, then fading as the year goes on, leaving Hamilton to claim his fifth world drivers title.

Verstappen goes five for five, 5 races, 5 contacts with other cars. Many are saying Verstappen is a future world champion, I honestly question that as he continues to make mistakes, he is no longer a rookie, no more excuses for him.
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#182

Post by Picci »

It ended up being a boring race, more because Ferrari messed up the entire weekend and Mercs went on unchallenged. That said, I still think Mercedes on balance has a better car in general. Spain is supposed to be the ultimate aerodynamic test and it came out clearly to me that they have an advantage. They just couldn't put it together in the first few races.

On to the next one, really.
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#183

Post by kals »

Missed by cameras (and commentator), Daniel Ricciardo spun under VSC conditions. I’ll link the video when I use my PC.
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#184

Post by myownalias »

kals wrote: 5 years ago Missed by cameras (and commentator), Daniel Ricciardo spun under VSC conditions. I’ll link the video when I use my PC.
I guess it didn't cost Ricciardo, with K Mag being over half a lap behind.
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#185

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myownalias wrote: The Spanish Grand Prix started out with a bang with Grosjean’s orchestrated carnage, before immediately declining into a bore-fest. The 2018 Spanish, or “Spainish” GP will immediately be forgotten in my mind.

Lewis Hamilton made an excellent start from pole position to lead the pack into turn 1, while title rival, Sebastian Vettel picked up a tow from Hamilton to sweep around the outside of Valtteri Bottas to move into second position. This was before, the turn 3 carnage caused by Romain Grosjean spinning out in a cloud of tire smoke through the turn 3 right-hand sweeper, taking out, not only himself but also Renault’s Nico Hulkenberg and STR’s Pierre Gasly, bringing out the safety car while marshals cleared the track.

McLaren’s Fernando Alonso clean drove around the outside of Force India’s Esteban Ocon at turn 3 after the restart to move into the points, meanwhile Hamilton was quietly building his lead, which was more than 10 seconds by lap 18. At which time, Vettel pitted for fresh rubber, moving onto the medium tire, but got held up by Kevin Magnussen for two laps. The German had to make a late dive past Magnussen to maintain his second position ahead of Bottas as the Finn had stopped and was exiting the pit lane.

On lap 25, the second Ferrari of Kimi Raikkonen seemed to make a move towards the pit lane, then suddenly aborted, allowing Red Bull’s Max Verstappen to slip by at the final corner. But, it was race over for Raikkonen as he failed to accelerate down the straight, also being passed by the second Red Bull of Daniel Ricciardo. Raikkonen was left to limp back to the Ferrari pits and into retirement from the race.

Hamilton pitted from the lead on the next lap, also switching to the white marked medium tire, to rejoin the track in 2nd place behind Verstappen, who had not stopped yet. Verstappen finally pitted nine laps later, relinquishing the lead back to Hamilton, where the Englishman stayed until the end of the race in what has to be considered a dominant performance. Verstappen rejoined the track in 4th place ahead of his Red Bull teammate, a few laps before Ocon stopped on the side of the road, causing a VSC period.

During this VSC period, Vettel unexpectedly pitted to put on fresh medium tires while everyone else, bar Force India’s Sergio Perez continued on track under the VSC delta times. This cost Vettel and Ferrari big time, not only losing out to Bottas, but also, Verstappen, rejoining the track in 4th place after a slow stop, which Maranello blamed on Perez pitting at the same time, and not wanting to risk an unsafe release. In my view, it was a poor strategic call, that cost them two places, blaming Force India is a BS excuse.

Meanwhile, during the VSC period, Verstappen had his fifth collision in five races, driving into the back of Williams’ Lance Stroll. The Dutchman damaged his front wing, which, luckily for him, didn’t seem to hinder his pace, managing to maintain a gap to Vettel to claim his first podium of the 2018 season. The final action of the race was Fernando Alonso claiming 8th place from the restart after the VSC, the Spaniard caught Charles Leclerc down the start/finish straight to complete the move into turn one.

As ever with the 2018 season so far, we have some controversy in regard to the -0.4mm change of tire tread, which many see as an advantage for Mercedes who benefitted from a major change of fortune using the new Pirelli rubber. Of course, Mercedes have rubbished these claims, as you would expect, but many Ferrari fans have been pushing the conspiracy theory that Pirelli, The FIA and Mercedes colluded on this change to advantage the silver arrows. I’m not convinced by the narrative myself, what do you think?
Source: http://www.the-fastlane.co.uk/formula-1 ... 18-review/
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#186

Post by Everso Biggyballies »

myownalias wrote: 5 years ago

As ever with the 2018 season so far, we have some controversy in regard to the -0.4mm change of tire tread, which many see as an advantage for Mercedes who benefitted from a major change of fortune using the new Pirelli rubber. Of course, Mercedes have rubbished these claims, as you would expect, but many Ferrari fans have been pushing the conspiracy theory that Pirelli, The FIA and Mercedes colluded on this change to advantage the silver arrows. I’m not convinced by the narrative myself, what do you think?
Source: http://www.the-fastlane.co.uk/formula-1 ... 18-review/
Pretty accurate review. Minor point is (and I take some blame myself for implying same in an earlier post) that I think the Perez pit stop delay excuse by Ferrari was actually not a Ferrari claim but more a commentary observation and comment made pre replay viewing, on the basis of them both pitting together and a potential reason. Replays show it was just a woeful stop with no Perez interference..

Re the tyre controversy I have heard and read some of the info, but it all seems to me to be a bit 'he said she said', to the point of not knowing where the truth actually lies. What is known is that the construction of the tyres was changed, and it was at the bequest of Mercedes, and it was challenged by Ferrari. Is that enough to proclaim guilt on the triumvirate of Pirelli, the FIA and Mercedes? Certainly a sense of where there is smoke there is fire.

To be frank I would not be surprised if there was some illicit conspiracy, but I have not yet read enough evidence to personally proclaim factual guilt.

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#187

Post by Everso Biggyballies »

Re the suggestion of Perez interference ?potential unsafe release suggestions discussed above, I have just read that Vettel has personally put his hand up for the blame for the slow stop, admitting he stopped well off the marks.
"It was my mistake. I overshot the box and the guys had to reshuffle and that cost us time."

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#188

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Everso Biggyballies wrote: 5 years ago Re the suggestion of Perez interference ?potential unsafe release suggestions discussed above, I have just read that Vettel has personally put his hand up for the blame for the slow stop, admitting he stopped well off the marks.
"It was my mistake. I overshot the box and the guys had to reshuffle and that cost us time."
I was just about to post this; just watched Ted's Notebook from the Sky F1 website and he said as much!
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#189

Post by myownalias »

Everso Biggyballies wrote: 5 years agoPretty accurate review. Minor point is (and I take some blame myself for implying same in an earlier post) that I think the Perez pit stop delay excuse by Ferrari was actually not a Ferrari claim but more a commentary observation and comment made pre replay viewing, on the basis of them both pitting together and a potential reason. Replays show it was just a woeful stop with no Perez interference.
I've heard the Force India blocking as the reason from many sources, but like you say, the replays don't lie.
Everso Biggyballies wrote: 5 years agoRe the tyre controversy I have heard and read some of the info, but it all seems to me to be a bit 'he said she said', to the point of not knowing where the truth actually lies. What is known is that the construction of the tyres was changed, and it was at the bequest of Mercedes, and it was challenged by Ferrari. Is that enough to proclaim guilt on the triumvirate of Pirelli, the FIA and Mercedes? Certainly a sense of where there is smoke there is fire.

To be frank I would not be surprised if there was some illicit conspiracy, but I have not yet read enough evidence to personally proclaim factual guilt.
Indeed, there does seem to be evidence of fire, but I don't believe it to be a major collusion between the FIA, Pirelli and Mercedes to advantage one team, most teams were having issues with tire degradation during the pre-season tests in Spain. Either way, it has definitely swung the pendulum in the direction of Mercedes, I guess we'll have to wait and see what happens in the next race where we return to the previous compound of tire. You do have to say that Mercedes, like Ferrari in the past have been getting their way a lot more than other teams in regard to exceptions and changes, such as the oil burning last season.
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#190

Post by Circuitmaster »

erwin greven wrote: 5 years ago
Honestly surprised at the leniency of this penalty (and I'm generally against penalties). What Grosjean did to earn a race ban in Spa 2012 wasn't nearly as reckless as what he did yesterday (Although the consequences were more severe at Spa, the actual mistake on his part was more forgivable in my eyes). This wasn't just a case of bad driving, it was actively stupid and highly dangerous.

He claims that he couldn't have avoided spinning back on to the track, which of course is nonsense. What car, when spinning to the outside of a corner with its brakes on would spear back towards the racing line? As the stewards say, the car was fully off the track, and it would have stayed there if he hadn't floored the throttle.
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#191

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Leniency is the name of the game ever since they abandoned the "Verstappen rule". People used to complain penalties were too harsh so they cut on everything including the in-race time add-ons (from 20 to 5/10). No more drive-throughs and so on. And now people complain about leniency? You can't have it both ways...
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#192

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Well I did mention that usually, in most circumstances, I am in favour of leniency and prefer not to see penalties dished out willy nilly - but when a driver is spinning his car back onto the track in front of the pack then I think that's one occasion in which a strong penalty is deserved. This is not a racing incident, or a failed overtake, or just wrong place wrong time - it was a very dangerous situation that could have been completely avoided but for the very poor decision making of one driver, and I feel he should be punished appropriately.

I'm not asking to have it both ways. I just want penalties to be reserved for the truly stupid and dangerous incidents. Like this one.
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#193

Post by Vassago »

Drivers are taking more risks these days bc overtaking is more difficult that it used to be. And that leads to more contact. DT for ANY avoidable contact would have been suitable but of course when the culprit scores a DNF then it's all moot so they have to apply grid penalty bc there's not much else left. Race ban is too severe (even given Grosjean's old reputation) and the penalty points system isn't much of a factor unless you have like three-four major brain freezes during the season. Even Grosjean ain't that reckless.
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#194

Post by Antonov »

given the safety of the cars these days, there is absolutely no reason to keep that dreadful chicane before the last corner.
it's clear it makes for one of the worst possible corners to line up from, with the last bend just adding to the turbulent air.
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#195

Post by erwin greven »

Antonov wrote: 5 years ago given the safety of the cars these days, there is absolutely no reason to keep that dreadful chicane before the last corner.
it's clear it makes for one of the worst possible corners to line up from, with the last bend just adding to the turbulent air.
It is done to make it possible to let the pursuing car follow the car in front much closer. I don't like that chicane either.
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#196

Post by Vassago »

The chicane is there primarily because of MotoGP tbh.
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